What distinguishes vertical issuer processors from all-in-one platform providers integrating with third-party providers in neobank market?

Guest: I will say that the truth is the lines have been blurring a lot recently. I would say the biggest thing you'll notice is that either of these vertical, like issuer processor only platforms are trying to step more into BaaS-like features whether or not they've actually succeeded.

Galileo, as an issuer processor, was one of the first to really step into being more of a BaaS service with their instant program, which was not very well run. And I think they ran into issues with their bank or provider. We've seen a couple of companies switch out of that program and a good number of people have abandoned it. They seem to have failed to deliver on their promises.

I think Lithic is one of the better, upcoming issuer processors. They have a lot of rough edges. I think they're kind of moving into BaaS service as well, but in a lighter way and they miss out on some things, such as ledgering, so that's a key thing that makes it a little bit different.

I would say the key to a lot of these BaaS services is that they provide some form of ledgering service. Ledgering seems to be the core component of every BaaS. Your issuer processors often do not provide that.